Anonymously in cowardice and without any communication or dialog with me, one of the 22 moderators of this site...
Anonymously in cowardice and without any communication or dialog with me, one of the 22 moderators of this site removed one of my posts. The post absolutely conformed to all community guidelines without exception. Aside from dumping the community, what is my recourse or appeal?
Your post, because it contains a link, was probably flagged by G+ as spam, & a quick decision was made, whoops. I checked the pic on your page, & found it fascinating, though it took me some time to realize that most of the photographs were yours. (Oh, & it was not me)
ReplyDeleteGoogle has been on a 'Rampage" in not only this, but several photo groups, that I moderate (18 in total, for those who count.) And, I spend far more time in my daly activities than I care, trying to revers this unfortunate, and un-reconcilable rampage.
ReplyDeleteSadly even after I approve and even plus many posts, it ends up yet again in the "penalty box" of Google.! This is happening a great deal lately, much as I abhor it.
I do not believe I was the one to deal with your post in particular. However, you need to know that this is Google, not moderators, and your moderators are very busy trying to correct, and re-correct this from happening.
Thanks #OshiShikigami and #PauliPPariah ! I apologize for any offense my language may have given. I hope that moderators will always contact community members before decisions about removing posts are made if at all possible. Even people who try to observe the rules sometimes stray and need a little coaching! I would also like to point out that to my knowledge no community member who posts to this community does so anonymously. When moderators make decisions their names should likewise be attached to their decisions (if Google is not taking those decisions out of their hands, that is). Speaking to our Community at large, may I also ask that more of us actually comment on submissions, particularly when they are categorized as "Discussion?" Likes, plusses etc. are great and time-saving, but there is nothing like the positive reinforcement of an actual comment! Every time I comment I find I learn something as I try to put my observations into words. Thanks for hearing me out!
ReplyDeleteJeff Diver, I am in complete agreement with you. I find it so frustrating to either have to reaffirm a post several times, or getting a post bounced for no apparent reason. As I have been on both sides a long time, I have a deep appreciation for a variety of frustrations that come. Some directly a poster's or moderator's fault, to be sure, but nearly always it is some automaton 'bot,' programed poorly by Google, making people angry and unsure.
ReplyDeleteMay i just add something regarding spam from my experience.
ReplyDeleteAt a great nature photography page with 800.000 members (i havent got often time to post there) sometimes my posts landed in spam too. I wondered why, because in communities where it is frequent, that posts land in the spam filter, i stopped to participate.
The Admin sent me a whole list of spam information regarding google. I remember a point which said, that if you post more than 2-3 posts in different communities of the same picture in a short time , it might land in spam automatically.
I had not know that before, so i am careful about that now.
I would like to add, that i love this community since the beginning, for many reasons:
for their fairness, high quality (in all senses), generosity (regarding our fotos and membership) and great people.
I feel 'home' here...
Best regards to you Jeff Diver :-)
PS: excuse my not so good English...
Naturpunkt by Gina M. Thanks for helping me better understand what is going on! I, too, admire the photograpic skills and applaud the willingness to experiment that I find in this community. The spirit of inclusiveness and encouragement is remarkable, especially for those of us who work with less sophisticated equipment (and occasionally produce, shall we say, "less sophisticated" results). That is why I was so surprised and hurt by the situation in the first place.
ReplyDeleteJeff Diver
ReplyDeleteI just remember that i was in a smaller community where i suddenly noticed, that ALL my posts were deleted by the owner. I wrote to him and asked, never received an answer and remember, how hurt i felt by such manners. I had not broken any rules. The photos just disappeared.
I understand your situation (and i guess all others as well) that's why i felt it maybe helpful to write and explain my personal view.
Sometimes internet can be very tricky, it's good that you asked and expressed your feelings.
Feel good! best regards
Gina
Always good to see what is both cause and effect. As, in may circumstances, it is not as one would pre-suppose...
ReplyDeleteHas anybody else experienced such an issue in our community? As far as I understand nobody has deleted the post explicitly - am I right?
ReplyDeleteThe last one I deleted was a couple of months ago. It was blatant spam and not even involving photography at all. None deleted since, for me.
ReplyDeleteAlthough I have approved and re-approved on the average several a day for this community for quite some time.
Oshi Shikigami thank you Oshi. I am not looking for somebody to blame. We are all humans: mistakes happen. I was trying to figure out are we dealing with the system error or with the human one?
ReplyDeleteMichael Mossiagin, As best I can determine, this is S.O.P. from Google automation. We actually have less than some other communities.
ReplyDeleteI get so very frustrated, and even angry, to see absolutely ridiculous assessments of what constitutes spam, via their automation. It infuriates me to have to unblock the exact same post, over and over again!
From my perspective, it is endemic to some extent in almost all communities. But for some unknown reason (to me) they especially pick on photo communities. This happens much more often to them. I have no clue why, either.
Thank you for letting me vent on this issue. It is a completely useless waste of time, and it tries me, and my patience, at times.
I did reject one photo because, checking the poster's page, it had been posted in more groups than I knew of, & it was a link to photographs not taken by the poster. I did comment & explain before rejecting
ReplyDeletePauli PPariah Oshi Shikigami Michael Mossiagin Naturpunkt by Gina M. Thanks all of you for the concientious job you are doing! I am learning a lot about this group and google community moderating by listening in on your conversation. Is there some sort of moderators' back channel where moderator housekeeping for this community, such as figuring out who did what if anybody did anything, could be carried out privately? If I were a moderator who had dumped a legitimate post, I might not wish to admit it in public. I also note that about 18 moderators of this group are maintaining radio silence. Are they inactive window-dressing? I ask because I was just appointed moderator of another group without requesting the assignment and wonder if some moderators of this community may have arrived on the scene involuntarily with lots of other distractions in their lives.
ReplyDeleteJeff Diver
ReplyDeletejust wanted to mention, that i am not a moderator. I could not do it because of several reasons. I do admire the ones who spend their time doing it.
I am wondering why you ask about the silent moderators here, i personally don't miss more moderating in this community.
Jeff Diver, I guess no one else answered this directly. So I will give it a try.
ReplyDeleteI suppose that there may be some special arraignments made in some communities to make a private "channel" of communication available to moderators.
However, in this community, or the seventeen others that I moderate, there is none I am aware of. If a need arises for private chat, a post only to those whom are needed, can of course be made. I have in the last three years, seen only a handful of them. It is not, as far as I am aware, SOP with any community. But it is always possible. But in any case, G+ does not offer any special Admin. only communications. So it would be ad-hoc and specific to a community.
Naturpunkt by Gina M. Always great to hear from you! I am greatful for your active participation in this community! Your encouragement and enthusiasm for photography is much appreciated. I'm sure you'd be a great moderator if you ever chose to accept such an invitation!
ReplyDeleteI agree with you about the amount of visible moderating going on here in this community. It's fine as is. It seems, however, that much of a moderator's time is taken up restoring posts removed by errant Google bots in the background.
I wonder if that is why 22 moderators are needed to manage a community of this size, and if there is some sort of recommended ratio of community members per moderator.
Oshi Shikigami Thanks for taking the time to discuss this with me (and any Community members that are interested). I'm amazed to hear you moderate 17 communities in addition to this one! That must be a full-time job, and not an easy one, either. Is it any fun?
ReplyDeleteJeff Diver, thank you for your comments. It is quite a "job". (No, I don't get paid! LOL)
ReplyDeleteSome times I get so tired and fed up I contemplate tossing in the towel. Some people are never happy, with whatever is decided. And I hate to be a judge of someone, or their motives.
But then I also know there are people, some who do not even recognize it, that count on me, or my other moderators, to make their time online enjoyable, informative, and safe. And that many people are not capable, or willing to volunteer to do so.
So, I take up the mantel, hopefully with humility, knowing I may not always get all of it right. So that others have a safe and enjoyable experience. This is one of the few ways, that myself, and I imagine some others at least, can actually do useful things to make other peoples lives in some small way better.
And for me this is something that makes me quite happy. I may not be able to do a normal "job" any more, And I may not have to. But If others are happy, it makes me happy, and feel worthwhile. And I believe that is what makes it all worth while. I cannot speak for others, but, I bet many would say, much the same.
Oshi Shikigami A big Thank You not only for the job you do here, but for being willing to discuss it with us! It's great being part of a community that actually discusses things under the label "discussion" for a change!
ReplyDeleteLOL! Jeff Diver I agree on those points. :-)
ReplyDelete